Helping Men Last Longer with Caitlin V

Premature ejaculation or "PE" is one of the most widespread challenges for men and couples that include men. There's no special pill being sold on TV.  And while it's not quite that easy to find good help -- we got you! There ARE solutions that work way better than trying to think about baseball or frantically masturbating before a date. 

Join me for a fun and important conversation with Caitlin V, fellow sex coach, YouTube sensation and host of Good Sex on MAX and Discovery+. Our conversation focuses on the best paths to overcoming PE, from her experience and mine. There's no shame, just practical solutions that actually work. 

Use this link to access her course "Come When You Want" for men and enter the code LauraListener for 10% off!

Lit & Luscious Women's Retreat in Hawaii January 2026 is open for registration and early-bird discount! Come to Hawaii with me & co-host Kama Hagar for The Most Fun Retreat Ever Made -- just for you. 

Go to https://www.kamahagar.com/retreat-page/ to register now and give your future self the best gift ever.  

Get my free email newsletter with helpful tips, plus a free guide to Finding Your Deepest Turn-Ons, and learn how to work with me at https://laurajurgens.com.

Transcript

[00:00:00] Speaker: Welcome to Sex Help for Smart People. I'm Dr. Laura Jurgens. I'm here to help you have better sex, intimacy and relationships. So let's get at it. Hey everyone. Welcome to episode 73. I am so glad you're here for this interview I'm doing with Caitlin V, who is a wonderful sex coach and has some special classes, particularly for men about.

[00:00:27] Coming when you want to, not sooner than you want to. So we're gonna talk today about premature ejaculation or PE as it's often called, and I think you're really gonna enjoy this interview. I am super happy to welcome Caitlin v today. And Caitlin, I'm gonna have you introduce yourself because I know you are the expert on you, but I just want you to know, I'm really glad you're here.

[00:00:51] Will you tell us a little 

[00:00:52] Speaker 2: bit about you? Oh, thank you. Thank you so much. Yeah, absolutely. And thank you so much for having me. To be here. I'm Caitlyn B. I'm a sex and relationship coach. I'm a YouTuber and a host of good sex on HBO Max. And for the last 10 years I have really been focused on working specifically with men and male sexuality and sexual dysfunction, and that's become my, uh, here and on the internet.

[00:01:16] Speaker: I love that so much. So we are going to talk about. Men, one of the big issues for men, which is premature or like earlier than you want ejaculation today, men ejaculating before they'd like to, with, you know, a lot of men have the aim of lasting longer during, especially during penetrative sex. And I am so curious about your approach because I have one approach that I've learned from the Somatica Institute and it's worked great, but I'm.

[00:01:49] I mean, we all know there are more ways to approach an issue and the more tools we have, the wider range of people we can serve. And so I would love to hear about yours and. Just like what you do, but first I actually, for men out there with PE issues and of course people of all genders partnered with them, it might be understandable to wonder how you and I come to be discussing this when we don't have penises.

[00:02:14] Yeah. I was care how we know anything about it. So I'm wondering, can you tell us a little bit about your background on this issue and in men's sexuality in general, and just why you think this is so important. 

[00:02:26] Speaker 2: So the way that I became an expert in male sexuality was very unexpected. It wasn't like something that I chose.

[00:02:33] I, uh, was working as a researcher before I became a coach, and my focus then was really on bisexual women. And when I started coaching, I sort of figured that I would continue to work with populations that were like me. And then I was featured on a YouTube video on someone else's channel, and the subject was squirt and squirting iss very popular on the internet.

[00:02:53] And it, it happens to be a very popular. Uh, search for men who are dealing with some kind of performance anxiety, especially premature patient. They wanted to learn more about it as like a thing that they could do to sort of compensate for what they perceived to be lack that they had in bed. And so I went from coaching a kind of, a little bit of every, like more of a generalist to having thousands of men, many of whom were dealing with ejaculation, asking for me to coach them.

[00:03:22] And I developed my. Methodology around working with PE organically by, by working one-on-one with hundred men who are dealing with it. And you know, it's very interesting. I hear, especially on the comments on YouTube and all over the, you know, um, why should I trust a woman to, uh, to coach me on something that is like very explicitly related to my opinion?

[00:03:48] Right? And there's a couple different ways that I like to handle that question. Uh, number one, I like to say. Botanists aren't plants, but that doesn't mean that they're not experts at all. The things related to it. Doesn't mean that they don't understand the process of photosynthesis. Right. And sometimes when we are outside of something and understand it a lot more holistically than if we are inside of it.

[00:04:09] And I like to think a lot of the men who, especially in space as an influencer on the internet, have kind of worked on or solved their own ejaculation, can't necessarily speak to all men, right. Because it's just their own individual experience. Right. At the same time, I think a lot of people really prefer to take, um, you know, a cisgender woman and my perspective on sex and sexuality having been with men, right?

[00:04:33] I have, I have seen penises up close and personal and experienced men's sexuality from a lot of different men. And I think there are a lot of people, people who organically understand that and see that having a woman's take, especially if they are straight and they with women, that that is a valuable perspective because it exists outside of themselves.

[00:04:53] Speaker: Absolutely. And also I think sometimes people feel more comfortable talking to women about things that are a little sensitive around, you know, some male identity. Like, because our identities are so wrapped up in our sexuality and our penises if we have them 

[00:05:10] Speaker 2: that, yeah. And I think talking to women as like as, as help as helpers, as caregivers mm-hmm.

[00:05:16] As confidants comes very naturally to a lot of men. 

[00:05:19] Speaker: Absolutely. So thank you for sharing that because I just wanted to kind of get that one outta the way since sometimes people do wonder. I love the botanists are Not Plants analogy. I think that's a wonderful one. So, um, great. So what do you think from your experience, are the most common causes underlying pe?

[00:05:43] Speaker 2: Hmm. I think in almost all cases, like certainly the great, great, great majority, it comes down to performance anxiety, pressure, intention, right? Mm-hmm. Uh, and another way of saying that is it comes from a relationship to study that is grounded in expectations, pressure, uh, um, and a lack of connection. 

[00:06:06] Speaker: Yeah.

[00:06:07] Speaker 2: As opposed to a real ability to. Be present with arousal, uh, be present with sensation, and to remain connected to our own body, uh, and then through our body to our partner's body. Mm-hmm. But I'm also curious to hear your thoughts and, and like I'm, I'm not familiar with how the Somatica Institute, uh, address with your ejaculation.

[00:06:28] So I, yeah. Curious to see where we come, where we're together, and where we might 

[00:06:33] Speaker: Totally. And I'm guessing there's gonna be a lot of overlap and maybe just some like, and I would say that, you know. I'm just one, one person Sure. Who taken their lessons and, you know, applied it in my practice. And so the way I talk about it might not be the same way that like Danielle and Celeste who founded Somatica would talk about it.

[00:06:50] But I agree with you in, in. A lot of ways I think I would just, you know, for me, I always say it differently in my head than the way you said it, but I think it's the same thing, which is essentially this the, so not just the pressure and the sort of performance orientation and then also a habit. In my experience, there's also a lot of habit that gets wrapped up in things because we get shamed for masturbation early on and a lot of boys are kind of hiding.

[00:07:19] Their masturbation and trying to get it over quickly, early on. As teenagers, they also get into a bit of a somatic habit with the body. Mm-hmm. Where they're used to going from zero to 10, with 10 being like, I'm about to come. There's no way I am stopping. Right. And they're used to going from zero to 10 really fast.

[00:07:38] And so their body gets kind of trained at that. And then there's also this sort of, like for some men, there's like a little bit of scarcity mindset around sex, like. I like, we get that anxiety that you're talking about comes in like, well I have to make the most of this opportunity. Or like, when you're a teenager, you know, old as girl's willing to make out with me and like, oh my gosh.

[00:07:56] She's like, wants to have sex with me and like now I gotta like, there's this anxiety and tension that grows in the body. And that disconnection that you're talking about from the self is also not like from your own physical, somatic experience is not allowing you to. Calm down and really release some of the tension in the pelvis.

[00:08:14] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. 

[00:08:15] Speaker: That, that tension in the pelvis builds and kind of contributes to the whole thing in, in my experience. 

[00:08:20] Speaker 2: Yeah. That, you know, orgasm, one definition of orgasm is the pleasurable release of tension. So if you're going to any sort of touch or sex or intercourse with a ton of tension, you are already that much closer to orgasm.

[00:08:34] And so you're not really setting yourself up for success if you're feeling a a ton of tension And yes. A thousand times over that scarcity mindset and add to that all the pressure. I'm like, am I gonna get it right and. Gonna, you know, be able to please her and I'm gonna satisfy her. And, you know, the, the greatest irony of that is the more that we focus on satisfying our partner, the less that we're actually inside of our own body.

[00:08:56] And I think we could also talk the, the, um, influence of porn on that as well, because porn does a lot to, to remove us from our body mm-hmm. And to get us out of our bodily, you know, our groundedness and then to ex. Support a lot of our turnon onto a screen or outside of ourself. And then to train ourselves, you know, human being are really, really good at getting to, uh, especially male bodies are particularly good at getting genial out because that's how we continue our species.

[00:09:26] And so when it learns about like visual on some amount of stimulus, ejaculation. We pattern that over and over and over again. The human brain are like software and hardware we're operating, especially the old stuff is like great mission accomplished, done right. And it, so it takes time to, to decondition that.

[00:09:46] But just as easily as we can train our do that, we can also train them away from it. Absolutely. Yeah. 

[00:09:52] Speaker: Absolutely. So what about. Some of the practical issues that you find men with penises don't understand when it comes to pe. Do you think there's anything that people are just as assuming, like that you think is just wrong in terms of how they approach it?

[00:10:12] Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, yes. Um, only 'cause I've heard it a thousand times. Oh. So I think number one, a lot of men, uh, believe erroneously that their penis. Are just more sensitive than the average man's, right? I hear this over and over and over again. You know, you just don't get it, Caitlyn, I'm just more sensitive. I'm just super sensitive and it's like, you know what, the Clint is super sensitive too, right?

[00:10:35] Yeah. Twice as sensitive as 

[00:10:36] Speaker: a whole penis. 

[00:10:37] Speaker 2: Yeah. We have so many more nerve endings and yet you don't find that we, you know, uh, uh, orgasm with just like a few strokes, right? It, this anything doesn't really work for me because the average male penis is average for a reason, right? It's about average in size.

[00:10:51] It's average in. But in length, like it's average in the number of nerve endings. It's not that your penis has more nerve endings in it, it's that nerve endings have been trained in a really particular way. So the good news with that is I always like to say that I'm reading a book right now and I was just writing this last night, like, congratulations on being average.

[00:11:09] Actually, like that there, there's a statistical significance to that, and it doesn't mean anything bad. It means that you're, you're probably. In the middle of the pack on most things. Right. And then you'll be an outlier on a couple things too. Just like statistically, this is how we all, this is a law of averages, right?

[00:11:25] So if other men can train their bodies to last longer and can change, I don't wanna decrease sensitivity. I'm very against, uh, decreasing or even disassociating from your body. I don't think that things like numbing sprays are really. A viable solution to premature ejaculation. There is some evidence that supports that men who use them learn that they can last longer, and then they are able to recreate that without the numbing sprays.

[00:11:50] But in my opinion, I just wanna teach you take to that sensitivity differently so that it doesn't feel so overwhelming. 

[00:11:56] Speaker: Right. Yeah. It's more possible. Totally. How you relate to that sensation than it is the sensation itself. Yeah. And I hear you saying, you know, actually you're probably normal. You know, like, yeah.

[00:12:06] You're probably normal and you just have, you know, and it's also, this is so common. It is so common. One, one third of 

[00:12:12] Speaker 2: men. Yeah, absolutely. One out of three deal with premature ejaculation at one point in their life. So super common, but we don't hear about it as much as, say, erectile dysfunction because there's no medication that can widely be prescribed.

[00:12:23] So there's really no money in treating premature ejaculation. Right. So yes, do prescribe off-label SSRIs, which are, uh, anti-anxiety antidepressant drugs. They describe what's supposed to be a sub perceptible dose of those. It, it, it changes the levels of serotonin in the brain, and serotonin is directly related to, uh, ejaculation, but it can also kill libido.

[00:12:45] It can actually give you depression or anxiety mm-hmm. If you don't already deal with it. Like there, there's side effects for these medications and again, there's just not a lot of money to be made on premature ejaculation, so it doesn't have the same sort of. Media coach and cultural attention as erectile dysfunction does.

[00:13:01] It also happens to be that erectile dysfunction is more common. Older men who have more resources and more capacity to address those, more money to spend on those challenges. But to get back to your original question, the other thing that I hear a lot, uh, from men, especially younger men, is that they've developed a workaround.

[00:13:20] They just commit to the workaround instead of doing the work to actually address the premature, like the 

[00:13:26] Speaker: association or the, trying to think of baseball or whatever that kind of thing is 

[00:13:29] Speaker 2: that, or they're like, well, I'll just masturbate real quick in the morning, have a date. I'll try to, you know, give myself an orgasm as, you know, close to the date as possible.

[00:13:39] Or, you know, I have a short refractory period. So, uh, the first round of intercourse. Last three minutes, but then I'll have sex again and it'll last like 15 or 20 or even longer. I, I commend people for doing problem solving. Yeah. You know, 

[00:13:54] Speaker: everybody's just trying to figure it out the best they can. 

[00:13:56] Speaker 2: Yeah, totally.

[00:13:57] They're trying 

[00:13:57] Speaker: to figure it out in a way that helps please their partner. I commend them for that too, 

[00:14:02] Speaker 2: and I think a lot of that problem solving actually doesn't work to please your partner. Yeah. Right. Because agreed. Having to, you know when, when you ejaculate and there's nothing wrong with that, but if you ejaculate like earlier in the morning on the date, like it might help.

[00:14:13] Nice for you to save all of that erotic energy and have it sort of to share with your partner, right? You may, you may approach sex a little bit differently. Not wrong to feel satisfied and satiated. Maybe that actually helps to calm your nerves. Maybe that actually helps you to be more present with her, to take things more slowly, get you outta the scarcity mindset because your body's ejaculated more recently, but it may also be in higher service.

[00:14:37] Partner's, pleasure for you to like have that energy, but know how to work with it, know how to shape it and to use it to your advantage. There's no wrong way of doing this, but it is, it's not, and and also, let's just be real. You're the adult. You have a job. It might not be feasible for you to have an ejaculation before every, not just that, but I tell all of my clients and everyone who watches my content to make sure that you're never masturbating for 15 to 20 minutes, right?

[00:15:03] Because I want you to train your body to extend the period. Time between arousal and ejaculation. So now we're talking about do you have an extra 20 minutes, maybe 25, all said and done. 'cause you gotta like, you know, get turned on and you gotta clean up afterward and you, you know, hopefully you take a minute to like ask in post orgasmic glow.

[00:15:21] Like this could now be a bunch of time. Really. And then like, what if you don't time in your partner? Like, it's just, it's not a really long-term workable solution. It's a, it's a bandaid, right? 

[00:15:29] Speaker: Yeah. Agreed. And it could be counteractive, like you said, if they're doing it really quickly and now you're reinforcing the same.

[00:15:37] Nervous system habit. 

[00:15:38] Speaker 2: Yeah. And not to mention that that may work okay. In your twenties, your thirties, maybe even your forties, but as your refractory period lengthens with age, that is not going to be a workable solution for forever. Right. And I just don't want you to have to rely on something that isn't actually any sort of solve, right.

[00:15:55] That doesn't actually really address the thing. The other thing is very related for my guys who are like, well, that's okay, I can just go multiple rounds. Yes. Today, these circumstances in this body. Right. And they tend to be in like relationships that are newer, they tend to be mm-hmm. Early thirties.

[00:16:13] Mm-hmm. Once you're in a more established relationship like that, that that may not work for you and your partner. But here's the other thing. As a woman, it doesn't feel great to have a quick round of sex or a quick round of intercourse followed by a longer round of intercourse. Maybe totally fine, but it's not necessarily like what everyone is choosing together, right?

[00:16:34] Again, it is a worker. Yeah. And you know, I've had clients who will have sex with someone, but then, or like after, after the first round, like they don't wanna give her anymore oral sex or they don't wanna do that. They don't wanna, like, they're the range of options that are available to them by doing this multiple rounds, workaround.

[00:16:54] And if you always have to have 

[00:16:55] Speaker: sex in a certain way. Your partner doesn't really have any input on, we've got a problem here. 'cause now we're now they're just trying to have sex in a way that validates them. 

[00:17:05] Speaker 2: Yes. 

[00:17:06] Speaker: Instead of actually trying to connect with a partner in a way that your partner actually wants to have.

[00:17:11] Speaker 2: Right. To 

[00:17:11] Speaker: be having sex. And most women are not ready to have penetrative sex really quickly right away anyway. It 

[00:17:19] Speaker 2: doesn't necessarily feel great to have like three minutes. It doesn't feel great. I mean, it really doesn't feel great to have 

[00:17:23] Speaker: a dick in your pussy until you are like really, really ready for it.

[00:17:27] And that typically takes 30 to 45 minutes of foreplay, right? 

[00:17:30] Speaker 2: Yeah. And then you're really ready for it. And then it's like three minutes of that and then pause. Well, and then when you're 

[00:17:36] Speaker: really ready for it, you want more than three minutes of that. 

[00:17:39] Speaker 2: Yes, exactly right. Exactly right. So again, or 30 seconds in 

[00:17:42] Speaker: some cases.

[00:17:42] Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. So workarounds. Totally appreciate the problem solve, but they don't really work. Those men who are exactly, if you're, if you're willing to actually treat the cause and not the symptom, it's like, you know, yes, you can take Excedrin every time you have a headache, right? But you also could do the work to stop having headaches to begin with.

[00:18:03] Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. Way better. And our culture will tell us constantly because we just have such a, like advertising capitalist driven society, it, we're so trained to want to go for that silver bullet, let's just take a pill. But wouldn't we rather address the underlying issue and not have the problem in the first place?

[00:18:23] And 

[00:18:23] Speaker 2: this, this is one other issue, I think, is that it's really highly normalized. You know, I'm. Very privileged in that the men that come to work with me and watch my videos and that I like come into contact with, really dedicated to being great lovers, right? That that's why they're on my channel to begin with.

[00:18:39] And so it's such a pleasure to work with because that's the baseline that they're starting from. But we have normalized as a culture, very short lasting and we've normalized that intercourse. It's something that women give to men or allow men to do to them, and men have normalized for themselves. You know, and this also, I'm not anti-porn as a whole, but like we have to talk.

[00:18:59] It's influence here. 

[00:19:00] Speaker: Yeah. When it's the only sex education we have in our whole society and it's non-education. It's just entertainment. It's entertainment. Yeah. So 

[00:19:08] Speaker 2: all of this combined together, and naturally men and women have this view of sex that it is like for men to enjoy. Mm-hmm. And for women to sort of put up with.

[00:19:17] And in that context, then a man lasting for like 30 seconds or minutes, or even just like six minutes and a woman not having an orgasm, it's like doesn't really exist. Problem inside of that framework. Yeah. Right. And then 

[00:19:31] Speaker: people wonder why they have, why their partners, why their female partners wind up with zero libido.

[00:19:37] Yeah. Because the sex was never for them in the first place. And then people are like, oh, it's my hormones. It's not your hormones. Right. Haven't been getting sex. That was for you for years. 

[00:19:48] Speaker 2: Yeah. Or 

[00:19:49] Speaker: pain, long-term pain discomfort. Right. Absolutely. '

[00:19:51] Speaker 2: cause these not warmed up, they're not being treated, you know, with kindness.

[00:19:56] We, we would, we would. Warm up before we would run a marathon. Right. And yet the way that we treat the vulva and vagina is like, it should just be ready to have a marathon it. Yeah. As if its a vending machine at 

[00:20:07] Speaker: any 

[00:20:08] Speaker 2: given moments. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. 

[00:20:09] Speaker: Yeah. We are a hundred percent on the same page on that.

[00:20:11] So y'all, what we are talking about is a totally different approach to sex and it does require some new rewiring of how we approach it. Mm-hmm. New learning. So, Caitlyn, for you, what is your approach? What if you could just give it to us in like kind of a nutshell, or if you have steps you can outline. How do you usually work with people to approach pe?

[00:20:34] Speaker 2: Yeah, so first of all, I wanna, I wanna start by saying it doesn't have to be hard. You know, we are talking about a totally d perspective angle, uh, uh, approach related to sex and sexuality. Mm-hmm. And it does take a little bit of work. It's a little uncomfortable. There's some rewiring stuff, but it like, it doesn't, no, it can be fun, hard, it can be super fun and it's very, very rewarding.

[00:20:54] I like to say the way you do one thing is the way you do everything. So if you rewire the way that you do sex and sexuality, you can expect to achieve different experiences and benefits and like it will, it will bleed over into the other areas of your life as well. So you can have a great sex life and it.

[00:21:09] Is it to like uplevel all areas in your life, and it doesn't have to be hard. So with that as the foundation for my methodology, whether I'm, it started with premature ejaculation, but I have expanded it, the same methodology, the same approach for erectile dysfunction, for, uh, delayed ejaculation. It always starts with the body.

[00:21:28] For premature ejaculation, that means. The way that we physically relate to the body. In other words, the way that you masturbate, masturbating for 15 to 20 minutes, a minimum, not always ejaculating when you masturbate, because again, we wanna train your body that like you could against a lot of sensation and you may not end in ejaculation that that's not necessarily a given.

[00:21:48] Right? Begin to train the body. Scramble that pathway that goes always if A, then always b. Mm-hmm. Uh, I like to change up their masturbation routines, different times of day, different body position, a different erotic material. Maybe we get rid of porn altogether. Maybe we switch to still images, just one porn star or just still images of your actual partner.

[00:22:10] Maybe we get rid of erotic images altogether, and we switch to a different kind of erotic stimulation, like a, a meditation or, uh, any of the incredible audio erotica that exists out there. Maybe we get rid of it entirely. I also teach, uh, of relating to the pelvic floor, including doing reverse kes so that we, 'cause a tight pelvic floor is a strong pelvic floor and a lot of the ways that men exercise or work out actually ends up tightening in short pelvic floor.

[00:22:37] So again, that increases tension, puts you closer to orgasm, uh, and then breath work because, and I think breath work sounds like kind of woo, but we're breathing all of the time. It's just utilizing this. It's just the same way that like changing your diet because you're, we're always eating, changing the way that we breathe so that we can have a different relationship with our nervous system when we go into either sex with a partner or into masturbation.

[00:23:00] Mm-hmm. And also like before we go into a meeting with the boss, right? So like utilizing these tools that come directly from the body in order to begin to reshape the relationship with the body. And I start with the body for a couple reasons. Number one, like if I was working with someone with Ed, I wanna start with the body because the, the erection is the body's check engine light.

[00:23:18] Something else may be going on physiologically, but with premature ejaculation, when we start working immediately with the body, that gives it the most amount of time to transform. Right. When you start going to the, you don't expect that you're gonna walk out with a six pack after your first session or even after I session.

[00:23:34] I 

[00:23:34] Speaker: know, and I wish it worked like that, but every time I do like a massive deadlift session, I'm like, how come my ass isn't twice as big when I'm walking out of the gym? 

[00:23:42] Speaker 2: Yeah. Right. And it, it's, it, it incrementally shifts over time. Does. I started, I didn't. Start working out seriously until I was like in my mid thirties.

[00:23:51] And it took two years really of working out. I do Pilates two times a week to like really have a, like, have my body feel significantly differently. Different, yeah. Than it did. Yeah. Mm-hmm. And it doesn't, and the interesting thing is, even though it feels very different to and have inhabit my body, my body doesn't always look very different.

[00:24:10] Some days it does, some days it doesn't. Right. It's just, it's sort of this thing that like, we have to commit to the practice of it because it is slow, the body is slow, it's in the 3D. Mm-hmm. It's just, it's always gonna move slower. It's meant to move slower. That's a good thing. So after we address the body, we address the mind, the thoughts, the, like, you know, ticker tape of words and beliefs.

[00:24:29] Mm-hmm. Things that we, you know, for the most part have like ingrained in ourselves as true related to sex and sexuality. Like, I can never change this. I'll never get better. Uh, she's unsatisfied. I'm not enough. Uh, you know, those things I was mentioning earlier, like sex is something that she's putting up with.

[00:24:49] I'll never be loved, like women don't actually want to accept me. I, it's what it's right. Like all the negative beliefs and, and then some of the empowering beliefs too. But we always, always move to addressing those. And I think men, this is one of the reasons that I love working with men in my experience, women.

[00:25:06] A little bit more, uh, willing to have some degree of malleability with those thoughts. I think like a lot of women, and let me not paint with too broad of a brush here, but in my coaching experience, a lot of women are like willing to recognize that some of the things that we think are not necessarily true, we don't necessarily know which ones.

[00:25:24] Right. Uh, they're of, of course, it doesn't matter what gender you identify as, there are some beliefs that you have that you are just like gripping onto white knuckling. Yeah. Nope. I know this is true no matter what. I am definitely. And most humans, we think 

[00:25:37] Speaker: if we think it that it must be true, even though that is absolutely not the case.

[00:25:43] Speaker 2: And I have found that for men especially, I think because they are not culturally conditioned from childhood to maybe question themselves or question their beliefs in the same way. Obviously this is part of patriarchal conditioning and it's not great for women, right? It's not good that we are raised to constantly be questioning ourselves, but on the opposite side.

[00:26:01] It's not great that men are raised not to do that, right? Because they have a death grip on some of these thoughts. We spend a lot of time with my clients disentangling and really challenging, you know, how can you know that that's true? And they, uh, you know, I use this, this case that came up in my men's coaching group with this one of my clients.

[00:26:19] I never meet single women. And he, he insisted and he, I kept asking week over week, where do I go to meets? Where do I go? And I kept saying, man, I don't have the answer for that. There's no one answer. And I finally kinda lost my. Cool. And I went to the whole coaching group and I said, okay, everyone flood the zoom chat every single place you've ever met a single woman.

[00:26:39] And it was like the library, the auto repair shop, the DMV, front of the street corner at my parents' friend's, cousin's wedding at the right, like the truth was that he was capable of meeting single women and single women were around him. Actually, side note, this guy ended up dating one of his, so single women were literally with him from nine to five, and he wasn't.

[00:27:01] Because he had such an intensely held belief that he didn't and could not meet them. So it goes from physical body to the mental body. Then we do the emotional body. And again, something I love working with men is that men, uh, generally deal with something called normative male emia, which is an inability theme and process our emotions as fully.

[00:27:22] Uh, and it's, again, it's something that's condition, it's something that the world really rewards in men. Right? Just stuff it down. Don't feel anything. Is the only acceptable emotion, right. All emotions should get routed through anger. Uh, anger. And I think they're 

[00:27:37] Speaker: also allowed pride. Whereas women are the, those are the two ones.

[00:27:41] Women are disallowed while we're socialized. 

[00:27:43] Speaker 2: Totally. You're a bitch if you're proud and angry. Yeah. Right. Which we have so, so many reasons to be both. 

[00:27:49] Speaker: Yeah. But there's a whole host of beautiful other human emotions and difficult human emotions that it's true that boys are socialized to really stuff down, and it does a disservice to everybody.

[00:27:58] Speaker 2: Yeah. And it's true also that if you repress one emotion, you repress all emotions. You don't get to just repress sadness and then not also repress joy. Right, exactly. It's, it's, it, it, it happens to all of them all at the same time. Mm-hmm. So one of my greatest joys in coaching is helping men to just experience their emotions as like safe and appropriate and acceptable, because.

[00:28:19] They get so much power. I mean, we all do. I, I had the same thing. This is one of the reasons that it's so natural for me to coach. Like I said, I mean, when they started coming to me because of YouTube, it was like a natural fit. I was like, oh, this is, this is, I'm gonna, this is what I'm meant to do. And part of that is because I also was raised in the United States in the eighties and nineties, and I'm from the Midwest and you know, I was raised to like, work hard, don't trouble other people with your emotions.

[00:28:44] Uh, if anything like. Keep those to yourself, uh, kind of at best. Uh, and at worst just don't feel them at all. And so it's been a journey for me. Yeah, to have safety of experiencing Westerners. Man, we're just 

[00:28:55] Speaker: supposed to talk about the weather. Right. And we're good at it 

[00:28:58] Speaker 2: too. We're so, so good there. Yeah. You know, and I laugh because now I live in California and so I get to confront sort of my Midwestern condition on a regular basis, and all the ways in which I like really value, especially things related to hard work and suppress.

[00:29:13] Like, you could always be working harder and you could always be feeling less. Uh, and this, this is common from men, how men across the country and across the globe are raised. So. Mental, emotional. And then, and, and only then do we look at the relationship. A lot of guys, again, you asked me like what some of their uh, uh, kind of most common misconceptions.

[00:29:36] Myths Yeah. And misconceptions were, A lot of people believe that it is their relationship that is causing, that they're dealing with. Sometimes they're right, right. If you can get hard or you can last as long as you want, or you can reach orgasm when you're not with your partner, there are things related to.

[00:29:54] Relationship that are influential on the way that your dick and your orgasm and your speculation are behaving, right? But it is not your relationship that is causing those things, right? So the relationship is influential. We don't start at the relationship because sex starts with ourself. A lot of people have the experience of like sexism only that we do with other people and in relationship to other people.

[00:30:16] But as you know, and as you're smart. No, it's not right. It's something that starts with us. It, it stays with us until we take our very last breath. Our sexuality is our own. It's uniquely ours. So then we bring the relationship in. We talk about, you know, maybe the partner's expectations, but more often it's a lack of communication that's going on inside of the relationship.

[00:30:34] He thinks she wants this or needs this. She is just trying to. Appease him and like appease his ego and she's faking orgasms and no one's talking about it. Whatever it is. Yep. We bring that and then as we work on that piece, we eventually make our way to a uh, uh, a. Evacuation or an expect a, a, a, like we, we start to un some of the deeper things that extraction, that's the word I was looking for.

[00:31:04] We start to extract some of the other beliefs that we have that come from like our culture or family, and eventually we make our way all the way to sex as a spiritual experience because that's where I, even though I came up as a scientist, I believe that ultimately the best sex, the sex that I want my clients to be having is a spiritual experience.

[00:31:21] Mm-hmm. That is the, that's, that's the long journey that I move people. Mm-hmm. But as I said, hard, and that doesn't mean it has to be totally 

[00:31:28] Speaker: serious every time. Like, fun and play is also spiritual. 

[00:31:32] Speaker 2: Hundred percent. And in my, I love having fun almost to like a degree where I'm like, not everything has to be fun ca but I'm, I don't wanna pack for, but it's really when it's, could I make this fun?

[00:31:44] Speaker: Can we make it more fun? 

[00:31:46] Speaker 2: And we all need a 

[00:31:46] Speaker: little more fun as adults. 

[00:31:48] Speaker 2: Right. Well, and you know, we, I, I don't know about you. I'm in this, this position, like my job is very pleasure focused. Yeah, me too. And I like that way and I want it to be that way. So I'm like, hmm, can we make this pleasurable? Even though maybe my story or my previous experiences of that are that like it's sticky and not fun.

[00:32:06] Like can I let that go and inject some fun play and pleasure into all the things? 

[00:32:11] Speaker: Absolutely, a hundred percent. I love that. Thank you so much for describing your approach. So it's interesting 'cause this is very, it's very, very similar. I mean, we have a very similar, and I think that must be because this is what works, but Yeah.

[00:32:25] Um, and you work tend, you tend to work with like more like groups and, and in online courses, right? To I 

[00:32:32] Speaker 2: you still, do you still do one-on-one coaching or No, I still do one-on-one coaching. I ha. I work with like three clients a year, but I have a team of coaches who work for me. Mm-hmm. Uh, my flagship course is Come when You Want.

[00:32:43] That is on premature ejaculation and lasting longer in bed. So everything that we discussed today, including all of the actual exercises, the actual pelvic floor movement practice, the actual breathing exercise, the journaling, like all of that. Even how I want you to like track your time or time, the changes in masturbation and everything all exist in the come When You Want Course.

[00:33:04] Awesome. But I also. Some other courses that deal with like tips and techniques and yoni massage and lingo massage and, and breast massage. Yeah, orgasms. Cool. 

[00:33:12] Speaker: Okay. And we have a special offer for listeners here today for that come when you want course, which is 10% off. If you use Laura Listener as the code, and I'm gonna drop it in the show notes, but it's just Laura Listener and you just put it in when you're signing up for K Special, 

[00:33:31] Speaker 2: a special get, get.

[00:33:33] Gift for your audience. Yes. Thank you. Uh, yeah, you're so welcome. And I hope that, uh, you know, whether it's the percent, whether you're listening and you're doing the premature ejaculation or your partner, is that that course can be a really holistic, uh, uh, approach for whatever it is that, uh, that like needs to be best inside of your love life.

[00:33:55] Speaker: Yeah. Awesome. And how do they find it? What's the URL for their, for them to go to the course? 

[00:34:00] Speaker 2: Well, certainly you can go to caitlyn v neal.com and we'll give you, make sure that you have the, I'll put that in the, into the, in the 

[00:34:07] Speaker: show notes too, everybody so that you can access it. 

[00:34:10] Speaker 2: And that's Laura listener.

[00:34:12] Speaker: Yeah, code is Laura. Listener. Thank you so much, Caitlyn. This conversation was so fun. I really love your approach and I really enjoy talking to you. 

[00:34:22] Speaker 2: Same. Thank you. It was really a delight to be here. 

[00:34:25] Speaker: Wanna come to Hawaii with me. If you are a woman or you know any, send them right to my homepage, ww.laurajurgens.com.

[00:34:31] The Maui retreat info is there and it is open for early bird registration. Don't miss it, and I get to see you in Hawaii.